In-depth on School Safety with Chris Ragsdale - Part 2

David Owen: 00:00:00

We're concluding our discussion on school safety with Chris Ragsdale in this episode of the Inside Scoop. Hello and welcome back to the Inside Scoop. I'm David Owen.

Hopefully you've heard from the superintendent, Chris Ragsdale in the first half of the discussion in last week's episode. If not, make sure you do to get the whole story.

He and Felicia Wagner discussed the incident in Barrow county, the importance of code Red drills, and how threats are handled here in Cobb this week, they'll continue the discussion focusing on such things as bullying, crisis communications, and safety technologies. Now let's rejoin Felicia Wagner and Chris Ragsdale as they continue the discussion.

Felicia Wagner: 00:00:47

So some of the school shootings and shooters that we've learned over the course of a few decades complain that they were bullied. Some of their classmates say that they were watching these kids get bullied just constantly. I know that you can report that through this app as well.

But what, as a district, should we be encouraging for kids who are maybe bystanders to bullying or a recipient of bullying? I think those are two very different things. And as a bystander, you don't know what to do.

Sometimes you just, you know, you feel kind of powerless and you don't want to get somebody in trouble, but you also feel guilty kind of because you're not doing something.

Chris Ragsdale: 00:01:36

Yeah. Bullying is real, and we take it very seriously. And we do not allow bullying of any type.

Regardless of what the nature of the bullying is, we address it head on, we address it quickly.

And, you know, in the middle and high school specifically, we have a program called Expect Respect, and that teaches some of the things you exactly just said for kids to expect that they will be respected, that don't think that you're, you know, it's okay to not be respected. And we've developed our programs to deal with bullying in the district.

We have trained every single school and we, we have trained every single teacher and employee on those bullying programs. And I think it's very important to understand why we did that.

There are numerous programs that you can go out and purchase, and what you don't know sometimes is where all of those connections are within something you purchase.

And so what we have done is we have taken all of the ideas from our counselors, our teachers, our administrators, and we actually developed in response to the bullying situation, we developed our own program. So K through 12, we have a program for every single school. And like I said, we have trained our employees on those programs.

Felicia Wagner: 00:03:15

What would you say to. As part of the threat assessment? And I guess Just the stress of that in society and in the community.

What do you say to your staff who are experiencing these ups and ebbs and flows of the stress of those threats, aside from the task of investigating, but just the stress of it just constantly coming at teachers and principals?

Chris Ragsdale: 00:03:44

Yeah, I've said this a number of times. There's not a time in history that it has been harder to be a teacher than today.

Our teachers are the best in the world, and it shows in our academic success. That's why we hire teachers to be the best teachers that they can in front of that classroom.

So many times today, though, schools, not just teachers, but schools, are expected to be everything. A lot of students get their only warm meals at school.

So it's very important for us to realize, number one, the limitations, because there's only so much you can do in a day. And that goes along with. I've been asked about what my thoughts are on arming teachers, and I've said very publicly I'm not for arming teachers.

In the Cobb County School District, if other districts do, that's a decision that I'm not disparaging other districts if they make that decision. But in the Cobb county school district, I believe that I'm hiring teachers to be the best teacher that they can be.

If I'm also going to expect them to be a police officer, then now I'm expecting them to be the best that they can be at two different jobs. And you can only do one job to perfection, and that should be teaching.

If you're charging a teacher to be also the protector to carry a firearm and be a police officer as well, that's going to take away from the academic side of why they're there. So that's why I have a true delineation.

And I want our teachers to continue to be the best teachers on the planet, and I want our police officers to continue to be the best police officers on the planet. And I think those are two very distinct and different jobs. And I would never want to intermingle those jobs together and required.

Because to your very point, the stress a teacher feels today has never been higher just to be a teacher.

Felicia Wagner: 00:05:52

Yeah.

Chris Ragsdale: 00:05:53

So now let's not add to that.

Felicia Wagner: 00:05:55

So some folks in the community, and even in my community, because I got text messages from parents, they don't like the way that the school communicates with them. After the shooting in Barrow county, they need to be reassured. They want to know, are we at a heightened risk now because this happened?

What's happening? You know, you just Want your kid home at that point.

Chris Ragsdale: 00:06:22

Right.

Felicia Wagner: 00:06:22

So what do you say to that? Because there is a delay. You get scooped by, you know, the news all the time.

You get scooped by social media and then you get the formal communication from the school. So can you talk about that?

Chris Ragsdale: 00:06:37

Yeah. So the first thing I will say is the first thing not to do.

If your child's school has some type of event, the first thing that you want to do is get to your child. However, that's the first thing you should not do.

Because everyone trying to get to the school makes first responders job that much more difficult to be able to deal with whatever the situation is. The second thing is don't expect immediate, detailed information. We will communicate. If there is an event, we will communicate that very quickly.

However detailed information, we're going to make sure we get it right because we don't want to be part of the perpetuation of false information.

So we're going to make sure we're communicating hand in hand with law enforcement agencies if external agencies are involved, which for a large event, they obviously would be. And we're going to communicate appropriately whether it be parent to parents of just that school or whether it be parents of the entire district.

Because again, if it's at a particular high school, for example, you'll have middle and elementary feeder schools who need to know some of that same information as well.

But I think it's more important to have correct information communicated than quick information that may not be correct because then you make decisions based on incorrect information. As a parent.

Felicia Wagner: 00:08:18

Yeah.

Chris Ragsdale: 00:08:18

And we don't want our parents making decisions based on incorrect information. We want to provide as much and appropriate information as quickly as possible, but we want to make sure it's correct.

And look, I, like I said, I totally get, you know, if something happens at my child school, I want to be there with my child. I want to get my child to your point, I want to get my child home and safe where I think that they are safest in my house. And I get that.

At the same time, you know, if it's a high school, we've got thousands of kids that we have to make sure are safe.

And we work very closely with Cobb pd, Cobb Sheriff's Office, the municipality, the city polices as well, Georgia State Patrol, gbi, because in a situation like Barrow, for example, you're going to have the world showing up. Matter of fact, we sent some of our social workers up to Barrow to assist with, you know, with the aftermath of that incident.

So I'm very Appreciative of those employees who went and everything that they were able to do. And it kind of also goes to show that, yes, we are prepared here.

We're prepared to the point that we can go help others if they encounter an event that we're able to assist with.

Felicia Wagner: 00:09:39

If there is an incident at a school, is there a protocol that requires enactment of a response to go through the district or our law enforcement that are at the school, are they empowered to execute a plan?

Chris Ragsdale: 00:09:56

Oh, absolutely, yeah. Our school police officers, sometimes referred to as school resource officers, they are absolutely full post certified police officers.

They can make arrests.

They can do all of the things that a police officer can do In a situation like an event happening, you're going to have, like I said, you're going to have the world showing up.

And we work with, not to get into to details, but we work with and partner with all of our other law enforcement agencies on a hierarchical command structure. Once an event takes place so that everybody doesn't show up and there's too many, you know, there's too many bosses, you know, kind of thing.

Everybody knows there's, there's an order and everybody knows their part. Everybody knows what to expect in walking into a school that is under a code Red, for example.

That's very important for law enforcement to understand because school districts are different than a shopping center or a church or, you know, another event where there's a lot of people present a code red situation. You're going to encounter a very different environment when you walk into that. So it's very important that we collaborate and partner and also train.

There are a number of active shooter trainings that encompass all of the law enforcement agencies, not just school district, but Cobb pd Cobb. So Georgia State Patrol and the like.

So everybody gets an opportunity to work a training event as if it's real to understand what's going to happen in this particular school district.

Felicia Wagner: 00:11:34

Yeah. So my son is in seventh grade, he's 13.

Anytime, even if it's not as horrific as Barrow county, any time something happens in a school, as a parent, you start reevaluating. Where can I go volunteer? What can I do? Where can I put my two feet in to make a difference in our schools? And I'll put my hat on for the foundation.

We do the volunteer of the year.

Chris Ragsdale: 00:12:05

Right.

Felicia Wagner: 00:12:05

We have recognized numerous people that are part of Watchdog Dads and things like that. But what would you say to parents that they want to do something? I mean, just sitting at home or waiting for the email, the Detailed email.

That's hard. I mean, you just want to go do something.

Chris Ragsdale: 00:12:24

Yeah, exactly.

And again, so much appreciation for what you guys do for the foundation, for the volunteer of the year, because it's just amazing to see what volunteers are able to do in our schools. And certainly parents can volunteer in our schools.

You know, not too long ago, we had a thing called the pandemic, you know, where, you know, visitors and all these kind of things were put. Restrictions were put in place on schools, inappropriate for the most part, but we didn't know what we didn't know.

Now that that's in the rearview mirror, I think it's awesome that we're getting back to normal, to where parents volunteers are coming into schools to help, because it truly is a team effort and it takes the entire team. And you know, we've spoken a number of times about parents.

You know, when something happened, the parent just wants to get to their child and these kind of things. And I've. I've been asked a number of times about, you know, why are we not discussing safety if it's our top priority in board meetings?

Felicia Wagner: 00:13:31

Right.

Chris Ragsdale: 00:13:33

I'm actually doing a presentation on where we're going next, next steps for the district. However, we will never discuss our safety plans or really any components of our safety plans and procedures in public.

Executive session is the appropriate place for discussion with the board.

And I have had numerous conversations and presentations and discussions in executive sessions about our safety policies and practices and what we see moving forward as far as threat assessments and how we're going to deal with things moving forward.

So while it is hard for parents not to see and hear all of the details about everything we're doing, that's part of the safety process is keeping that information confidential. Yes, we talk about the collaboration with different agencies, but how we do that, that we're never going to talk about.

We've got evolve, for example, is the latest technology we're utilizing as far as weapons detection. The intricacies and details of that and where they exactly are we're not going to discuss in public. It would be reckless to do so.

So we will never discuss in detail to all of the things that we are doing and how we're doing them in public. Regarding safety. It's very important for us to make sure that we are prepared and we're appropriately training and funding safety.

And we will, we will discuss everything that we can in a public manner and communicate that to the public. But it's not going to be to the level that people truly want and Desire.

And I understand that, but I also understand the requirement to maintain that level of confidentiality.

Felicia Wagner: 00:15:36

Who do you feel is bringing you the most, latest, greatest information and data on the technology that you can implement in schools? Is that coming from randoms? You know, I work at IBM and we have this. Or is it truly people that are operating in that field who are bringing that?

Chris Ragsdale: 00:15:58

It varies really, because again, education is a different industry. Right.

You don't find many places, even at offices in corporate, that have the number of people we have, whether it be students or staff or both, in the campus environment that we have. And even though We've got over 100 schools, over 100,000 students, we have over 20,000 employees, every single campus is different.

You can't take a plan and have a cookie cutter template and then go to another school and exactly implement that same plan. It's just not going to work. So it does vary.

You know, best in industry, we have different things, you know, different organizations who bring us different types of solutions. I think that the easiest type of solution to find is the technology. Like evolve. Evolve is not just in schools.

It's in public places, arenas, professional athletic events, those kind of things where that makes sense. But then you get into a very popular topic, I guess you could say, after an event takes place like this, are metal detectors.

Why do you not have metal detectors? Well, there is a truly a fine line that you cannot cross to where a school becomes too much like a prison.

And you never want to cross that because you want a school to be a place for learning. You want kids to enjoy being there. You want teachers to enjoy being there.

And there is a line that you can cross to where you are making it too restrictive of an environment. I don't think we're crossing that line. I don't think we're up to that line yet.

Metal detectors, though, simply in a school environment don't work the way that people expect that they would. You have too many entries and exits.

Felicia Wagner: 00:18:15

It's so many different ways to get in. And you've got keys and you've got metal on your jeans.

Chris Ragsdale: 00:18:22

Absolutely.

Felicia Wagner: 00:18:22

All kinds.

Chris Ragsdale: 00:18:23

Absolutely. I mean, you think about the airport if you fly.

Felicia Wagner: 00:18:27

Yeah.

Chris Ragsdale: 00:18:28

TSA didn't used to exist. Right. You just showed up 30 minutes before your flight. You ran through the airport to get to the gate. You hopped on the plane. Not today.

Felicia Wagner: 00:18:40

Think about going to the Benz Stadium.

Chris Ragsdale: 00:18:42

Yeah, exactly. Yeah. But if you think about going through the airport, how long it takes when there is a crowd to get through security, and that's every day.

At school. So you would not. The operation of metal detectors in a school environment just does not produce the results that you would think that they would.

Now when you get in, again, different technologies like evolve. There are different technologies that do weapons detection in a different way and a different manner that we are utilizing.

Syntijics, again, being able to communicate during a crisis exactly what's going on, what the code is of what is a code read, how we communicate that. And there again, the syntegic system also allows us to have alerts from individuals needing assistance for whatever the situation.

It's a medical situation. So we're able to see where a teacher is or an employee is and they need assistance so we can get there very rapidly.

So I think that solutions come from a litany of sources.

I will tell you a frustration of mine is when an event like a Barrow takes place or like a parkland takes place, vendors trying to take advantage of that situation. To say, if you only had my product, your kids would always be safe. That is very frustrating.

And shame on them for doing that because they're just trying to take advantage of a crisis to guilt you into or guilt parents into demanding this product or that product or what have you.

And you know, school districts are doing everything they can and don't need vendors trying to take advantage of a crisis situation like a shooting in Barrow, for example, where people lost their lives and you're just trying to sell a product. That's very frustrating. But all that to say, I think again, where we're pointed for next steps becoming left of launch.

I think there's going to be a change in how you address safety in a school.

I think there's a lot of proactive things, not just the products and the technologies and things, but I think there's going to be a lot of proactive processes that can be implemented that's really going to boost our level of safety and security for both staff and students moving forward. And so again, part of that I'll be discussing during the presentation at the next board meeting, and part of it we simply can't discuss.

But I will definitely brief the board in executive session.

Felicia Wagner: 00:21:32

Well, Chris, I really appreciate your time today. I know we both have students to go serve. While I don't think we can ever eliminate us wanting our kids home and safe.

I really appreciate you taking the time to kind of deep dive into these really complex and hard things to talk about and certainly hard things to plan for, whether it's budget, staff, all of the things.

Chris Ragsdale: 00:21:56

Right.

Felicia Wagner: 00:21:56

But I really appreciate you I appreciate the team. I personally appreciate our teachers and our principals who are on that front line every single day.

Chris Ragsdale: 00:22:07

Right.

Felicia Wagner: 00:22:08

And and hope that they feel safe as much as our students do. So thank you for today.

Chris Ragsdale: 00:22:14

Absolutely. I appreciate the opportunity.

David Owen: 00:22:17

As you can see, the safety of our students and staff is the top priority of Cobb Schools. I hope you've learned a little bit about it in this episode. If you did, please give us a like and share it with an interested friend or two.

Thanks for listening to this edition of The Inside Scoop, a podcast produced by the Cobb County School District.